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Discussion Starter #1
I have stage 1. I have read here that one of the O2 sensors is no longer used with stage 1. Makes no sense to me, but I would guess it would be the one after the cat. Would this be an unsutable place to put a wideband sensor? Or should I just pay the $80 to get another bung welded in? I am going to be upgrading my exhaust in a few months and think it a waste to pay twice... Thanks.
 

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$80 box, there's a shop in my garage called "Do it yourself"

Take the DP out take it to the Exhaust shop and have them weld the Dawm bung.
I paid $20.

Dude come on !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! even if you dont have a garage.
 

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umm..ok, that was really uncalled for...

you can use that bung, yes. you dont even need S1 to do it either, you couldve done it with the stock PCM too. all you have to do is keep the O2 sensor close enough to the heat so that the PCM sees a change in temp, it doesnt have to read O2 correctly, since the downstream sensor is only used to determine the efficiency of the cat. it in no way effects the fuel trims or performance of the car...thats what the upstream is used for.
IRONICALLY tho....even tho the S1 doesnt read the downstream O2 sensor, it still must remain plugged in or you will get the CEL. ive tried it. so all i did was put my wideband into the DS O2 bung and then tied the OEM O2 sensor to the frame of the car right near the DP. works like a charm.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
So the AFR won't be drastically different downstream? I just don't want to spend the money if I really don't need to. How hard is it to take out the downpipe? I did one about 2 years ago, but it was full exhaust, and was a PITA.
 

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damn 80 bux? if you lived locally i would have welded a new one on for ya for like 20 at the most...
 

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Discussion Starter #6
That is a number I read that a few people paid on here... I live in LA County, so things are a little higher than many other places. But if it will work just fine in the downstream bung, then I will go that route with it.
 

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Installing an O2 sensor after a cat will give you improper AF readings. A WBO2 sensor should be installed prior to the cat.
 

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lunchbox660 said:
umm..ok, that was really uncalled for...

you can use that bung, yes. you dont even need S1 to do it either, you couldve done it with the stock PCM too. all you have to do is keep the O2 sensor close enough to the heat so that the PCM sees a change in temp, it doesnt have to read O2 correctly, since the downstream sensor is only used to determine the efficiency of the cat. it in no way effects the fuel trims or performance of the car...thats what the upstream is used for.
IRONICALLY tho....even tho the S1 doesnt read the downstream O2 sensor, it still must remain plugged in or you will get the CEL. ive tried it. so all i did was put my wideband into the DS O2 bung and then tied the OEM O2 sensor to the frame of the car right near the DP. works like a charm.
ftw imo
 

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slo-car said:
Installing an O2 sensor after a cat will give you improper AF readings. A WBO2 sensor should be installed prior to the cat.

what about the ppl that dont have cats??
 

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Discussion Starter #11
OK, how long should it take to get the DP out with just a jack and a couple of jackstands? And where can I get a decent wideband for lower than outrageous prices? About $250 for some UEGO sound good? Modernperformance has one.
 

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Why not just tap into the existing O2 sensor upstream from the turbo? Its what I did. I see what the PCM sees then. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Does that screw up what your PCM sees because you are taking some of the voltage that it should be seeing? Or is it meerly a signal voltage it is looking for???
 

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AC_ said:
Why not just tap into the existing O2 sensor upstream from the turbo? Its what I did. I see what the PCM sees then. :)
thats narrowband not wideband not nearly as accurate.......
 

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pavendort said:
Does that screw up what your PCM sees because you are taking some of the voltage that it should be seeing? Or is it meerly a signal voltage it is looking for???

you can use downstream but if you still have your cat it will be useless kinda....s1 s2 you can use downstream bung just do as other guy said zip tie it out of the way but keep plugged in....s0 is picky enough muchless with messing with o2 sensors
 

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lunchbox660 said:
so all i did was put my wideband into the DS O2 bung and then tied the OEM O2 sensor to the frame of the car right near the DP. works like a charm.

that's funny-- that is exactly what i did. how long have you had it like that? is it still in place and in good shape?

when i first did it, i thought it would be a good idea to take the plastic cover off the wb o2 and put it on the stocker to keep it protected. of course, i didn't think about the fact that it is a heated o2...lol
 

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uberingram said:
You haven't looked very hard. :stab:

i've looked at plenty. most that i've scanned have voltage readings between 1-5v--making them wideband. not saying that it is not a narrowband or that they are not used, just surprised that it would be when widebands are more accurate like the guy i quoted said.


edit: this is going to bother me. tonight i will scan it. if it reads 0-1v, i will :stab: myself. if it reads 1-5v, i get to kick you in the groin :tongue:
 

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Discussion Starter #20
OK, so how far off is the reading going to be if I still have a cat, and use the downstream O2 sensor? Are we talking deviation of .1, or 80% or what? I will have a new exhaust in about 6 months, so I will eventually have no cat, just have to get around those pesky Cali laws!
 
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