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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Does E85 work in the SRT4? I was thinking, due to its higher octane rating, HOM might stay on with it so you could run HOM all the time. Far fetched, but interesting to ponder. Anyone have more expertise on the matter?
 

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takes some work to convert over to 100% E, but a local has done it in his Evo. Not sure about HOM but he can run alot higher boost in his evo now.
 

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E85 can be very corrosive to the components in your fuel system. So typically your vehicle needs to be able to handle it, or you need to convert many of the orings, connectors, etc in your fuel system over to stuff that can resist the corrosiveness of the blend.

That is one issue,
the next issue with E85 comes from the tuning. The mixture of E85 has a much different stoichiometric point than the regular 14.7:1 AFR that you are used to with the standard gasoline. This fact results in a few things. First off, IIRC the stoichiometric point for E85 is around 10:1 AFR. So you will need very very large injectors since you will need to supply A LOT of fuel under WOT. I believe one of the AMS Evos that they converted to E85 was running like 1000cc injectors just to make in the 400-450whp range safely (again this is just off the top of my head). The next issue is your wideband meter you are using to tune, the wideband displays the AFR ratio based on a measured lambda given a specific scale based on regular gasoline. When you convert to E85 you will need a way to change this scale so that your AFR gauge is reading correctly. And of course most of all, you will need some way to tune your PCM based on all of the changes (i.e. the new stoich point, new O2 sensor parameters, new injectors, and new WOT parameters)... so typically this is done with an EMS, maybe highly configurable stock PCM, converter electronics, etc.

With all that said if you were to convert over to E85 successfully the typical octane rating of E85 is around 100-105, so it would be much like running unleaded race gas 24/7 :)
 

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I believe it takes more E-85 to make the same energy as gasoline?
 

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quite a bit more, but because of the higher octane, a turbo car has a much higher power potential. saab actually has a little convertible over in europe that makes MORE power on e85, with the factory computer
 

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that is why ethanol is not a good fuel alternative......i mean in the end how much corn can we grow....i heard that all the agave fields in mexico are gettin plowed under to grow corn for more ethanol...they said it will cause a tequila shortage lol ...
 

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with e85, you have worst fuel econo than using gas on a flex fuel vehicle. So less mpg but im sure they sell the stuff for over $2 a gallon right? Im still waiting for $165 for super back in 2002 or so.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
good replies. better discussion on the matter than I was expecting anyway. Anyway, I wasn't really bringing up the mpg aspect of E85. Purely the power potential of it. I also wasn't sure if the neon was able to run that fuel already. It would be really beneficial to all the toys users if it was.
 

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You are all forgetting that E85 has a greater heat of vaporization, meaning it is able to remove more heat from the incoming air than gas. It's effectively another IC.
 

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BLKDOUTSRT4 said:
that is why ethanol is not a good fuel alternative......i mean in the end how much corn can we grow....i heard that all the agave fields in mexico are gettin plowed under to grow corn for more ethanol...they said it will cause a tequila shortage lol ...
That's why biomass using celulosic byproducts are going to kick ass in the future. Corn husks, all the waste matter that gets tossed anyway. Mr. Fusion is only a step away!
 

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car and driver was talking about this. e85 is really not worth it in the long run. the editor was talking about making cars similar to the srt-4 in that it's a small engine with some sort of f.i. and using e85. he was saying something about upping the compression ratio and having 2 tanks, one for gas and one for e85. basically, using the two would have been worth it because you would have been spraying the e85 under heavy boost loads which would basically save on gas prices.
sounded goog the way he said it.
 

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BLKDOUTSRT4 said:
that is why ethanol is not a good fuel alternative......i mean in the end how much corn can we grow....i heard that all the agave fields in mexico are gettin plowed under to grow corn for more ethanol...they said it will cause a tequila shortage lol ...
:crying: tequila shortage FTL!!!
 

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i think hydrogen is a great alternative problem is it is highly dangerous in a collision im not down for driving a portable mini mushroom cloud...but hydrogen has massive amounts of energy and its in everyday water
 

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there are two other problems with hydrogen

1) storage capacity, which is being worked on (10,000 psi tanks)

2) Obtaining hydrogen. Yes, it's in water, but it takes a lot of energy to release from the oxygen bond (electrolysis) and this energy would likely come from coal fired power plants. So you are doing nothing more than changing the source of the pollutant. So yes you are reducing tailpipe emissions (remember air is 70% nitrogen, so there's potential of NOx) is it really cleaner than burning the dinosaurs in our cars??

I've also read about getting it from propane or other gases, but again similar problems.
 

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SRTCommemorative142 said:
there are two other problems with hydrogen

1) storage capacity, which is being worked on (10,000 psi tanks)

2) Obtaining hydrogen. Yes, it's in water, but it takes a lot of energy to release from the oxygen bond (electrolysis) and this energy would likely come from coal fired power plants. So you are doing nothing more than changing the source of the pollutant. So yes you are reducing tailpipe emissions (remember air is 70% nitrogen, so there's potential of NOx) is it really cleaner than burning the dinosaurs in our cars??

I've also read about getting it from propane or other gases, but again similar problems.
electrolysis is done with electricity ...so technically advancements in nuclear power plants would provide electricity to harvest the hydrogen
 

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E85 can be very corrosive to the components in your fuel system. So typically your vehicle needs to be able to handle it, or you need to convert many of the orings, connectors, etc in your fuel system over to stuff that can resist the corrosiveness of the blend.

That is one issue,
the next issue with E85 comes from the tuning. The mixture of E85 has a much different stoichiometric point than the regular 14.7:1 AFR that you are used to with the standard gasoline. This fact results in a few things. First off, IIRC the stoichiometric point for E85 is around 10:1 AFR. So you will need very very large injectors since you will need to supply A LOT of fuel under WOT. I believe one of the AMS Evos that they converted to E85 was running like 1000cc injectors just to make in the 400-450whp range safely (again this is just off the top of my head). The next issue is your wideband meter you are using to tune, the wideband displays the AFR ratio based on a measured lambda given a specific scale based on regular gasoline. When you convert to E85 you will need a way to change this scale so that your AFR gauge is reading correctly. And of course most of all, you will need some way to tune your PCM based on all of the changes (i.e. the new stoich point, new O2 sensor parameters, new injectors, and new WOT parameters)... so typically this is done with an EMS, maybe highly configurable stock PCM, converter electronics, etc.

With all that said if you were to convert over to E85 successfully the typical octane rating of E85 is around 100-105, so it would be much like running unleaded race gas 24/7 :)
Correct. Gas mileage will suffer since ethanol contains 34% less energy per gallon compared to gasoline; it has a lower BTU rating compared to gasoline. Ethanol also has a stoich of 9:1 compared to gasolines' 14.7:1, and is more suitable in a higher compression engine.
 

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This E85 shit is starting to piss me off, all it's doing is rasing all the prices in the food chain! WTF, and it sure the hell isn't lowering any of the gas prices!
 
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