Does God really exist? - Page 2 - Dodge SRT Forum
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post #16 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 02:15 AM
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the posibility of the exsistence of a being which could be called god is equeal to the posibility that one doesn't exsist......the posibility of any religion (human or otherwise) guessing his motives is 999,999,999,999,999,999,999,999,999,999 to 1.

"Necessity is the plea for infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves."
William Pitt

Federalist Papers


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post #17 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 04:56 AM
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Hmmm....In God's world there is no time. He created time in our world, that would have been his first order of business.

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post #18 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by FrequencyOmen
What's THAT supposed to mean?

I didn't mean any ill, I just thought your drawing was funny

"There is not even an emoticon for what I am feeling!"

<a href="http://www.stanford.edu/~atd10/quizes/fgquiz.html"><img border="0" src="http://www.stanford.edu/~atd10/quizes/brian.jpg"></a><br><font size="1"><a href="http://www.stanford.edu/~atd10/quizes/fgquiz.html">Which Family Guy character are you?</a>
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post #19 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 05:44 AM
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Wow what wonderful and thoughtful questions and a great respectful converstaion I might add (joy to read through). I want to chime in with some straight to the point answers, however some of them get a little complicated so hang with me.........

So much (if not all thats being discussed here) can be answered through study of the scriptures (notice I did not say "reading the Bible"). God teaches us alot about Himself, but often in small increments as we journey through His book.

Here goes some key points to consider:

Quote:
Assuming God does exist, how did "he" come to exist? Does "God", whomever you may want him to be have a creator? If everything has a beginning then it would only make sense that "God" would too right?
God said "I am that I am" , He told Moses (when he asked who should I said sent me?) that "I am" sent me. The Holy Trinity has always been and will always be. Its impossible to fathom as humans a being that has no begining. Do you realize that God holds all of us (the entire universe included) as a thought in His mind? He simply spoke us into existance. None of our world would exist save the for a thought in the mind of God. The Bible teaches us that the entire universe exists through Jesus Christ and because of Jesus Christ. Allow me to quote scripture from The Book of John, chapter one:

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.


Quote:
What was "God" doing for the roughly 14-16 billion years before human existance
A VERY IMPORTANT concept to get your arms around is that God operates OUTSIDE of time and its constraints. He is in all places and all times simutanuously. Also remember its already finished (in Gods mind). God started with the end and created backwards to the begining. Everything we will all do, say, experience, etc has already happened but we must "live" through it. God is already there so to speak. Also realize that the Bible makes it clear that "time" as WE measure it is not particularly significant (a day is like a thousand years and a thousand years is but a day unto the Lord)


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All that exists came to be by some cause and I feel that whatever is the "cause" is the path to discovering "God".
You got that right

Jesus said "I am the way, the truth, and the life, no man comes to the Father but by me"

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Noone knows what happens when you die, and we never will.
Actually we all will (when we die), I assume you meant while we are alive in the first life.

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There is alot of suffering in this world, I don't think an eternally kind "overlord" would let it get to the point it has.
Yes there is as a result of MANS sin against God and against himself. Thank mans sin nature for the suffering.

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So this makes me think that maybe there are different areas of heaven
Please permit me to bold this for proper emphasis.........

THERE IS ONLY ONE WAY TO HEAVEN and that is through Jesus Christ, ANYTHING else is an absolute lie.

Quote:
Another trivial question Ive wondered, If you die in space or on another planet...what happens to your soul then? I know many will say the answer is obvious but what if it isnt that simple?
Absent from the body, present with the Lord. The soul of a believer goes immediately and directly to Jesus Christ, no matter how or where you die

Quote:
Even the demons believe in god,but you wont see them in heaven.
Intresting and so true....... I love this passage of scripture were Jesus kicks some demon butt:

26They sailed to the region of the Gerasenes, which is across the lake from Galilee. 27When Jesus stepped ashore, he was met by a demonpossessed man from the town. For a long time this man had not worn clothes or lived in a house, but had lived in the tombs. 28When he saw Jesus, he cried out and fell at his feet, shouting at the top of his voice, “What do you want with me, Jesus, Son of the Most High God? I beg you, don't torture me!” 29For Jesus had commanded the evil spirit to come out of the man. Many times it had seized him, and though he was chained hand and foot and kept under guard, he had broken his chains and had been driven by the demon into solitary places. 30Jesus asked him, “What is your name?” “Legion,” he replied, because many demons had gone into him. 31And they begged him repeatedly not to order them to go into the Abyss. 32A large herd of pigs was feeding there on the hillside. The demons begged Jesus to let them go into them, and he gave them permission. 33When the demons came out of the man, they went into the pigs, and the herd rushed down the steep bank into the lake and was drowned

"my name is legion for we are many"............... great stuff


I will leave you guys with this parting thought from the mind of God:

From the Book of Isaiah chapter 55

8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.

9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

10 For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:

11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

We are have our place and God has His

John 3:16
"For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life."

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post #20 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 05:45 AM
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Originally Posted by n0idz
Hmmm....In God's world there is no time. He created time in our world, that would have been his first order of business.
I would agree in part.........

Time is at the mercy of God and submits to His will. Remember when God stopped time once?

John 3:16
"For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life."

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post #21 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 05:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Romans8:28
I would agree in part.........

Time is at the mercy of God and submits to His will. Remember when God stopped time once?
Refresh my memory....


I think we as humans(living) will never discover it all. Although we probably don't use most of our brains, trying to fill it with knowledge is like pouring buckets of ocean into a hole on the beach.

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post #22 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 06:56 AM
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Not one of these threads...

We will never know for sure one way or another. The end.

-A
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post #23 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 06:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Romans8:28
I would agree in part.........

Time is at the mercy of God and submits to His will. Remember when God stopped time once?
I remember when superman reversed time.

-A
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post #24 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 06:58 AM
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Hinduism is generally considered to be the oldest religion still being practiced today. This ancient religion was born when the Aryan peoples migrated to Northern India and first put their religious tradition into writing. The texts they created are the Vedas, which were written around 1,500 B.C.E. (before common era) and have greatly influenced Indian culture ever since.
Several other religions are almost as old as Hinduism. Judaism traces its roots back to the patriarch Abraham, who lived around 1,800 B.C.E. While the Jewish people are descended from Abraham, it was Moses who first recorded the Torah, the Jewish holy text, in 1,400 B.C.E. Most sources consider the date of the Torah as the beginning of Judaism.

Zoroastrianism is sometimes called the world's oldest prophetic religion. It's certainly one of the earliest religions founded by one person. Scholars are not certain when the founding prophet Zarathustra actually lived. Some believe Zarathustra lived in the 6th century B.C.E., while others trace his writings to the 14th or 13th centuries B.C.E.

India has been a veritable cradle for world religions -- in addition to Hinduism, both Jainism and Buddhism originated in India. The first of Jainism's sacred lords, called a Tirthankara, lived in the 8th century B.C.E. The last of these lords was Mahavir, who lived in the 5th century B.C.E. and was a key figure in spreading the religion. The philosophical teachings of Siddhartha Gautama, known as the Buddha, spread around Asia after his death in 483 B.C.E.

Oddly enough, the two religions that dominate the world today are relative newcomers to the spiritual scene. Christianity began with the teachings of Jesus Christ around 30 C.E., and Islam started in 610 C.E. with the prophet Muhammad's revelation.

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post #25 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 07:06 AM
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IMO they all hold about the same amount of water.

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post #26 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 07:14 AM
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There are simple rules to the universe that all must follow yes even God. This is what makes Him perfect is that he has perfect knowledge of all truth and all the wonders of the universe are known to Him. Nothing can be created nor destroyed. Only organized. God always has been, just as we all, have always been, and will always be. Now this somewhat contradicts the traditional "Christian" viewpoint of God being the creator of the universe. Not really. OUR universe and everything WE can grasp, meaning all the stars in the heavens was all organized by God. As far as we're concerned, there is only one. There is only one that we need to follow and obey to return to Him. The body we were given, the planet that we live on, was given to us. It is a gift. We were given a set of rules to follow. Follow the rules to the best of your ability, and have an honest heart and sincerely try to follow ALL of Gods rules, then you return to His presence. Follow not the word of God, disobey his rules, constantly mock God, then face His judgement. Seems pretty simple. We don't have to BE perfect. We have to TRY, and when we screw up, have enough humility to go to Him and ask for forgiveness and strive to learn and not repeat the sin. I hope this makes some sense as I'm half asleep.
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post #27 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 07:19 AM
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Originally Posted by dodgeboywonder
odd nonsense,why is there suffering,well that goes back to adam and eve,because of their original sin,their is now sin all over this world.so in other words we brought all of this on ourselfs.
Well just to throw alittle philosophy on the fire. Buddha was a prince who's father did not wish for his son to ever suffer. He sheltered Buddha from all that would cause him suffering. Buddha had a vision of three people suffering. A starving man, a man dying of disease, and a poor man. Buddha set out to see why man suffers and what exactly is suffering. While starving himself and giving up all his riches Buddha reached Zen and came to these conclusions.

1.) Man suffers because of a want for things he or she does not need.
2.) The minute we stop wanting things we don't need is the minute we stop suffering.
3.) The happiest place lay in the middle. Too much of something or not enough of something leads to suffering, live your life to a content middle.

Although I am not a follower of Buddha there is alot of truth to the above three statements. Why do we have crime such as theft, drug abuse, murder? Mostly because someone out there wants something they don't need and steals and kills because they want it and can't earn it.

I don't lie, I just embellish the truth for entertainment purposes....
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post #28 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 07:21 AM
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god exists but not in the teachings of the church

are souls are merely here to collect wisdom

its all trial and error

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post #29 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 07:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildmouseX
the posibility of the exsistence of a being which could be called god is equeal to the posibility that one doesn't exsist......the posibility of any religion (human or otherwise) guessing his motives is 999,999,999,999,999,999,999,999,999,999 to 1.
Well if you subscribe to the idea that the univers is infinite, yet spherical and outwardly expanding, and we exist in a miniscule section of the universe in which there are numerous unbalanced forces working upon us I.E. the gravitational pull of the sun, the large gaseous body planets, and the outward movement of the universe in all directions that has continued since the big bang. Yet, in all this chaos everything seems to work with a clocklike perfection. The slightest change in any of the systems would lead to disaster and our certain deaths, yet nothing goes truly wrong.

The odds of our universe working the way it does and our existence not being wiped out by it statistically puts me in the group of people that believes that there is a supreme creator. Statistically its the only answer....

I don't lie, I just embellish the truth for entertainment purposes....
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post #30 of 573 (permalink) Old 04-05-2005, 07:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Goki337
Well if you subscribe to the idea that the univers is infinite, yet spherical and outwardly expanding, and we exist in a miniscule section of the universe in which there are numerous unbalanced forces working upon us I.E. the gravitational pull of the sun, the large gaseous body planets, and the outward movement of the universe in all directions that has continued since the big bang. Yet, in all this chaos everything seems to work with a clocklike perfection. The slightest change in any of the systems would lead to disaster and our certain deaths, yet nothing goes truly wrong.

The odds of our universe working the way it does and our existence not being wiped out by it statistically puts me in the group of people that believes that there is a supreme creator. Statistically its the only answer....
There is an equally compelling argument to this line of logic. The universe is the way it is by chance, and we just happen to 'work' in it. It doesn't have to be 'crafted' for us.. we just happen to exist as we do in it's current state on this current little planet. it's like a lottery winner.. can they really say "Someone picked ME especially to get these winnings.. if they didn't, I wouldn't have them, right??" Of course this is nonsense.. they won the money by chance. You can equally argue we exist by chance. Of course.. that really makes no sense either, as "chance" is non-existent in a causal universe. That means we were 'meant' to exist from the very beginning. I personally think that 'consciousness' is like a law of the universe.. as strict as the laws of gravity, magnetism, etc. if it were not, we would not have it.

In closing.. you can bend and mold any perspective when it comes to the reasons for our existence, reality, etc. Pick whichever you prefer, life will go on either way.

-A
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