I fixed my FPR, and the exhaust leak I had, thought I'd be good to go to retune now, but I'm still having issues.
With everything setup for 1:1 rising rate, injectors scaled properly, returnless table modified like it should be, fuel trims are fine, WOT blows the tires off through 1st and 2nd (4 speed auto), falls on it's face being overly rich and sputtering in 3rd. Can't go WOT in 3rd at all, instantly too rich. Doesn't matter how high or low I set the boost, same thing every time. If I only give it about 75% throttle, it's not as bad and pulls pretty hard, but still way too rich.
Set it for static 58psi, injectors are scaled properly, returned the returnless table back to stock values. Set the boost at 10psi for this test. Fuel trims are good. Go WOT, and instant lean, 18:1, like it's not giving it any extra fuel at all. If I only give it about 50% throttle, I'll get as much as 5psi of PTB, and it compensates accordingly, doesn't go too lean.
This got me thinking maybe it's a MAP or TPS issue. Checked TPS voltage, it was something like 0.6 with no throttle to 3.63 at full throttle (engine off), so that should be fine. Checked MAP voltage, 1.65v with the engine off, 0.55 with the engine at idle, set the brake and slowly gave it throttle, watched the voltage increase as I did it, so that looks fine too. Checked voltages at both the sensor and at the PCM, same on both ends.
As a final test, still hooked up static 58psi for the fuel, I only scaled the idle/part throttle area of the PW tables. So from 584 to 2744 micro seconds the injectors are scaled. Idle/part throttle are great, fuel trims are great. From 14352 to 31000 micro seconds I left all the values stock. In theory, this should cause it to be very rich as soon as I got WOT. However it behaves exactly like it did when I scaled the entire table. As soon as I got WOT, it's instantly lean.
It's almost as if the PW tables are broken for my code. Either that, or there is something weird going on with my DW750 injectors that I have no explination for. With static 58psi fuel pressure, the only way I can get any fuel under boost is to jack up the S2 VE table values (from a pressure ratio of 1 or higher, don't have to touch the vaccuum area of the table), which I should not have to do. With 1:1 rising rate, the opposite problem exists, it's too rich, and the only way I'm able to lean it up is to remove a ton of fuel from the boost area of the VE table. Doesn't matter what I do to the PW tables, they seem to have no affect on WOT.
I'm starting to think there's something wrong with my processor code in Advantage 3. I don't know what else to check.
Fuel system is good.
MAP sensor is good.
TPS is good.
Any ideas?
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One of a kind custom turbocharged 2004 Chrysler Sebring LX Sedan
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13.5 @ 102mph
Nope, both pumps are good, checked them both (in tank 190 walbro feeding an external 255 walbro). Also I would not be able to get more fuel by hooking it up rising rate, or raising the VE table to near max values if the pumps were bad.
Mindmelt, the software Engineer for Diablo's Chryslers, PM me saying he was having a hell of a time getting a set of DW 750 to work worth shit.
If i were you, I'd throw in an extra set of injectors, rescale and retest.
Do you have an extra set laying around? Not sure where in Central IL you're at, but I'm headed down to Springfield for the weekend on Friday. The only injectors I have laying around are my stock NA injectors that are probably 19lb injectors at best, not up to the task of handling any boost.
That makes me feel a little better knowing someone else has run into the same problem. This has been driving me insane. I only have about 4000 miles on these injectors, but I'm way past the 12 month warranty. Everything worked fine last year, but the car was parked from October to March.
Do you have an extra set laying around? Not sure where in Central IL you're at, but I'm headed down to Springfield for the weekend on Friday. The only injectors I have laying around are my stock NA injectors that are probably 19lb injectors at best, not up to the task of handling any boost.
That makes me feel a little better knowing someone else has run into the same problem. This has been driving me insane. I only have about 4000 miles on these injectors, but I'm way past the 12 month warranty. Everything worked fine last year, but the car was parked from October to March.
you should send them out for flow testing. did the car have fuel in it while it was parked? just sitting?
you should send them out for flow testing. did the car have fuel in it while it was parked? just sitting?
It was just about empty, maybe 3 or 4 gallons in it tops, 16 gallon tank in this car.
Can't really even afford to have them tested/serviced right now... sending them to DW for that would cost half as much as just buying a brand new set. :\ All my money is going towards my 5 month old little girls medical bills right now. Trying to see if I can find someone local to swap injectors with just to test it out, at least that way I can confirm or eliminate them as being the problem without spending $$$. Then I'll know I need to save up to have them fixed and can stop messing with it.
Do you have an extra set laying around? Not sure where in Central IL you're at, but I'm headed down to Springfield for the weekend on Friday. The only injectors I have laying around are my stock NA injectors that are probably 19lb injectors at best, not up to the task of handling any boost.
That makes me feel a little better knowing someone else has run into the same problem. This has been driving me insane. I only have about 4000 miles on these injectors, but I'm way past the 12 month warranty. Everything worked fine last year, but the car was parked from October to March.
Well I'm only 20min south of Springfield but I don't have any extra sets for an SRT. All I have that will drop in are some 20lb out of a 5.9 magnum and a set in the 5.7 hemi I just picked up for the Baracuda. I think the hemi's are only 25-30lb.
I suspect the way DW modifies their injectors for higher flow screws up the mg/pw, radically and unpredictably changing the mg/pw curve.
Its would be best to have the injector's mass flow mapped for 3-4 different pw.
Last edited by duster360 : 04-30-2009 at 11:26 PM.
I only have a set of stage 1 injectors... I don't have anything bigger.... They are my OE injectors. Let me know what you want to do. I will loan them to you if you paypal me the cash for shipping and then return them to me when you are done.
I agree with duster. I have tuned several cars with DW650 and 750s. Some of them I had to tweak the injector tables a lot more than I should have, if the flow rates were consistent. I am sure your set is probably matched, but they have been different between sets. That's not to say that they have not improved, but that is my experience. The RC750s, while a pain to install, have been very consistent between sets, even between the older SL and newer SH series.
Well I'm only 20min south of Springfield but I don't have any extra sets for an SRT. All I have that will drop in are some 20lb out of a 5.9 magnum and a set in the 5.7 hemi I just picked up for the Baracuda. I think the hemi's are only 25-30lb.
I suspect the way DW modifies their injectors for higher flow screws up the mg/pw, radically and unpredictably changing the mg/pw curve.
Its would be best to have the injector's mass flow mapped for 3-4 different pw.
I thought about grabbign 4 injectors off my Hemi Ram, but realized they would be that small.
I don't have the flow chart that's supposed to come with these injectors anymore, but I think I might be able to get the serial number off them and see if DW still has a copy.
Quote: Originally Posted by nemiro
I agree with duster. I have tuned several cars with DW650 and 750s. Some of them I had to tweak the injector tables a lot more than I should have, if the flow rates were consistent. I am sure your set is probably matched, but they have been different between sets. That's not to say that they have not improved, but that is my experience. The RC750s, while a pain to install, have been very consistent between sets, even between the older SL and newer SH series.
That's just great... can't even ask someone else with the same injectors what they had to scale, 'cause chances are it may be different even though they are the same brand and size injectors.
Today I dropped my base pressure down to ~43psi, rescaled from 584 to 2744 micro seconds to match. From 14352 to 31000 I multiplied by 1.6, and it's still rich at WOT with 1:1.
I only have a set of stage 1 injectors... I don't have anything bigger.... They are my OE injectors. Let me know what you want to do. I will loan them to you if you paypal me the cash for shipping and then return them to me when you are done.
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