SCT and E85

[SebringLX]

Quote: Originally Posted by nemiro

Yes, I am working on it, and yes, the '08 Avenger is a NGC car, with an ethanol sensor. I am months away from anything conclusive, so don't start banging on my door for a tune, it's just not there yet, and I won't release anything until it has been tested to my satisfaction.

The '08 Avenger is probably going to be NGC4 IIRC.

You may want to look at the 04-06 Stratus or Sebring Sedan's with the 2.7L V6 in them. They were available with the Flex Fuel option, and they used the NGC3 controller. 03 and some of the 04's still had the NGC1.

I know all of the NGC3 codes I've looked at have had ethanol tables in them. However just because the table exists doesn't mean it's turned on and being used. There's probably a bit in there to activate or deactivate them that we don't have access to through Advantage 3.

[NoisufnoC]

Quote: Originally Posted by Santiago.

it just hit 4.30 for 91 yesterday.

are you saying +30% due to the extra fuel needed?

does it actually consume 30% more during idle/close loop conditions?

i could see while WOT...but 30% MORE consumption at idle/Closed loop is pretty crazy.

still cheaper than the 5.85/gal for race gas...

i just want more octane.

I was under the assumption that the car will consume 30% more fuel all the time. I could be wrong.

Usually E85 gets lower gas mileage...right?

[Santiago.]

**subscribed.

not sure on whats up, so ill wait for the e85 gurus to explain.

[wannasupra]

E85 gets fewer mpg because stoich for alcohol is much richer than it is with gasoline. ~9:1 iirc, although someone will probably correct me.

[Santiago.]

you dont get cylinder wash w/ an AF of 9:1?

[SpeedEuphoria]

Stoich is where the fuel burns most completely, so it should not be much of an issue if any. The cylinder wash is from richer then stoich where all the fuel is not burned so some goes out the exhaust and some may wash the cylinder. So just because E85 requires more fuel volume to be stoich(partially because its oxygenated), doesnt mean that it will wash the cylinders.

Also the A/F number is just a multiplier, stoich of all fuel is lambda of 1, its just the multiplier thats different. Meaning if your wideband is set for gasoline and your using E-85 you still tune to ~14.7 A/F for idle and cruise, and 11.5 A/F for WOT(or a little richer b/c E-85 wont loose power going richer like gasoline), its just going to need more fuel to get those readings.

[Santiago.]

ahh i see.

thanks for clarifying man.

[dj4monie]

One way the EVO guys look at it -

They don't compare E85 to 91/92/93 high octane pump gas. They compare it to 87 octane because in most cases its closer to that price than to the high test.

When you put it that way, you burn more E85 overall and your mileage suffers 2-3 mpg, but the cost ends up being less still than running 91, but you no longer have to buy racing fuel because in reality E85 is closer to 110 octane...

That's what has been repeated then tuners try to dial-in the timing.

So you save money over high test and using high octane racing unleaded and if you ran E100 I doubt you need to run C16... Which I think is overkill anyway.