Besides the hassle of getting the vin number programed at a dealer, does anyone know what the programing or power differences between the different years of stage 1 are. What I mean by this is, if you put a 2004 stage 1 on a 2005 will it make less power than if you installed a 2005 stage 1.
First, All PT Stage 1s are are year specific, you cannot put a '04 Stage 1 on a '05, (as per Flight Systems Research, they are the programmers for the Stage PCMs) and yes the '05 & up Stage 1 has a a little more power than the '04 and back models, this was proven by me and several other '05 and '06 stage 1 cars on the dyno, starting with the '05 the Stage 1, the spec/install sheet shows 235hp to the wheels, '04 and back show 235hp to the crank this was confirmed by the Mopar hot line techs and on the dyno, my PT is a '05 DC4 Auto Stick, with Stage 1 Kit w/exhaust, plugs & wires as per the Stage 1 upgrade recommendations for full Stage 1 power levels, it dyno'd several weeks ago at 235whp, 295wtq, there are at least 4 other '05 & up Cars on PT Crew that all dyno'd around 230 to 235whp and 290 tp 315wtq with just a complete Stage 1 upgrade ie.(PCM, exhaust, plugs & wires) no other mods to the boost or WGA, most of the '04 and back Stage 1 only dynos I have seen are in the 177 to 205whp range.
Also all of the above mentioned cars have this 235whp with Automatic transmissions, so I do not know if the 5 speed cars will dyno higher or not, there is an approx 20% loss in the PT Auto trans drive train, so that would be about 280+ hp to the crank for the '05 & up, vs. the 235hp to the crank of the '04 and back Stage 1 PTs.
First, All PT Stage 1s are are year specific, you cannot put a '04 Stage 1 on a '05, (as per Flight Systems Research, they are the programmers for the Stage PCMs) and yes the '05 & up Stage 1 has a a little more power than the '04 and back models, this was proven by me and several other '05 and '06 stage 1 cars on the dyno, starting with the '05 the Stage 1, the spec/install sheet shows 235hp to the wheels, '04 and back show 235hp to the crank this was confirmed by the Mopar hot line techs and on the dyno, my PT is a '05 DC4 Auto Stick, with Stage 1 Kit w/exhaust, plugs & wires as per the Stage 1 upgrade recommendations for full Stage 1 power levels, it dyno'd several weeks ago at 235whp, 295wtq, there are at least 4 other '05 & up Cars on PT Crew that all dyno'd around 230 to 235whp and 290 tp 315wtq with just a complete Stage 1 upgrade ie.(PCM, exhaust, plugs & wires) no other mods to the boost or WGA, most of the '04 and back Stage 1 only dynos I have seen are in the 177 to 205whp range.
Also all of the above mentioned cars have this 235whp with Automatic transmissions, so I do not know if the 5 speed cars will dyno higher or not, there is an approx 20% loss in the PT Auto trans drive train, so that would be about 280+ hp to the crank for the '05 & up, vs. the 235hp to the crank of the '04 and back Stage 1 PTs.
My 5 speed dynoed at 260hp to the wheels with the AGP WGA and a map clamp. Boost is set to 23 pounds. I do think that the 5 speed has less loss of power in the drivetrain. Now, my 05 Auto GT only dynoed at 211 whp. So, what was the dyno that was being used and what were the temps? It might make a difference.
My 5 speed dynoed at 260hp to the wheels with the AGP WGA and a map clamp. Boost is set to 23 pounds. I do think that the 5 speed has less loss of power in the drivetrain. Now, my 05 Auto GT only dynoed at 211 whp. So, what was the dyno that was being used and what were the temps? It might make a difference.
Here are two others besides mine that I could find right now, mine was a Dyno Jet, and it was in the 60s outside but we were in a heated garage so I don't know the temp as it was not printed on the sheet.
I still had part of a tank of 93 octane gas with a can of Torco octane booster left over from the track the day before where I ran a 14.6 @ 96mph (with a 3600 lb convertible), Since the Stage 1 install at 3000 miles my PT has always boosted to 17psi and dropped to 15 and held all the way to 5800 and then dropped again to 12 or 13 till red line, so I still have some work to do. (I have a MAP clamp,Stage 2 WGA, 55mm TB to install when the weather breaks)
There are at least 2 more, but I could not find them at the moment , but I seem to remember that most were on Dyno Jets and all were right around the 230 -235 mark, Just a thought though, does your '05 Stage 1 install sheet state 235 @ the Wheels or @ the crank on the power graph, as some where on the Crew it was mentioned that there were two different dated install sheets with the two different dyno graphs for the '05 kit.
Also, as I have mentioned on the Crew before my '05 DC4 (built 8/04), has a rare "S" engine code in the VIN, which for '05 is a SRT4 engine code, where the PTs have a "G" for a GT HO and a "8" for the lite in '05, so I don't know if it makes any difference as far as power or not, but so far the only '03 to '05 PTs found with the "S" engine have been the '05 DC4 convertible.
I have a 5 speed 05 GT turbo convertible. It actually feels pretty quick and will spin the tires at will in first gear. I was looking for some more power and found a 04 stage 1 for $200. If the power was the same for the 04 vs 05 stage, I was going buy it and try to get the vin number programed at the dealer. It looks like there may be a big enough difference in power, so I will just wait until I find a used 05 PCM for sale.
It does look like the 05 stock PCM may be good for the guys with the turbo lites.
It does look like the 05 stock PCM may be good for the guys with the turbo lites.
Nope. Turbo Lite guys just order up a Stage 1 PCM for their year and plug it in. Been there, have that. We end with exactly the same HP (depending on year) as a GT does when Stage 1 is added to it. Stage 1 is the great equalizer.
I have a 5 speed 05 GT turbo convertible. It actually feels pretty quick and will spin the tires at will in first gear. I was looking for some more power and found a 04 stage 1 for $200. If the power was the same for the 04 vs 05 stage, I was going buy it and try to get the vin number programed at the dealer. It looks like there may be a big enough difference in power, so I will just wait until I find a used 05 PCM for sale.
It does look like the 05 stock PCM may be good for the guys with the turbo lites.
I do not think that an 04 will work on an 05. The dealer may not be able to reprogram the VIN even, and I do mean even, if they have the know-how. There are many stories out there where the dealers wiped out the Stage 1 programming. If that happens, you are stuck sending the PCM to Flight Systems for a reprogramming.
I could be wrong,but I'm sure I've seen threads where SRT-4 guys are using ECU's from different years; I've even seen a chart listing what years were compatable-gonna look for that.
I could be wrong,but I'm sure I've seen threads where SRT-4 guys are using ECU's from different years; I've even seen a chart listing what years were compatable-gonna look for that.
That is possible but the SRT4's have less items under ECU control versus the PT's.
The srts can get away with it. The only thing they have to worry about is an 03-04 S1 will set off the battery light in an 05 because it doesn't have a battery temperature sensor.
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Stage 1 differances
. If that happens, you are stuck sending the PCM to Flight Systems for a reprogramming.
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