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Supporting Vendor (Gold)
Join Date: Apr 2003
Member Number: 623
Location: Cleveland Ohio
Posts: 16,189
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Here are some questions and answers.
Modification Questions
Can it be done without a voltage clamp of some sort?
I would say most likely not. The timing tables are just to low. My theory would be water/alchy, cams and a good ported head , and trying different things on the dyno might get it done. I just dont see the point in not using a clamp though. The safc, emanage, mamp clamp, dtec, power paq will all make it easier.
What is a map clamp?
very simple. The clamp hides boost from the PCM, which in turn keeps timing high. It also leans the fuel curve out.
Why do you ask? Real simple. Every turbo car from the Factory is programed to give more fuel and less timing when the ecu reads higher boost. Now this is dependent to the map sensor. Via 2 bar or 3 bar..or whatever. The map sensor reads the boost and sends a signal via 5 volt , voltage to the pcm. The higher the volts, the more fuel and less timing the motor will see. THis is done to keep yahoos from blowing their motors. The thing is, Mopar went over board with it. They claim that the EGTs[ exhaust temps] get to high with increased boost. That basically means that turning up the boost, even with a healthy A/F ratio can melt your motor. Thats not a good thing. Now we solve that problem via the map clamp. The map clamp will keep the timing high, in turn bleeds some of the EGTs off. I have proven this a million times. Im not going to get into anymore of that crap.
The map clamp will only allow a certain voltage pass through to the pcm. As i stated before the higher the voltage seen by the pcm, the lower the timing and more fuel you get. We all know the srt runs very rich from the factory. So just leaning it out some will make power, let alone raising timing. The map clamp is adjustable so it can act like a fuel mod also. Its basically a crude SAFC, which is a map clamp per rpm instead of per boost.
Will other mods substituded for the ones listed work?
Absolutley. A dumped exhaust will work inplace of a 3"" exhaust. Contact needswings for one. Water alchy will help alot and also bring the egts down and raise timing. I dont recommend other WGA`s though. AGP is by far the best, trust me. I have tried them all. Any piggy back will work in place of the map clamp... I like the dtec the best.
Are all the mods needed?
No. The mods listed are what i feel will keep the car safe and have been proven time and again to work. Others will go a different route. Some it will take more mods and some will take less.
Do I have to use a staged pcm?
No. Any of the pcms out there will get it done. THats why I recommend the stock pcm. Why spend the money if its not needed. IF you want a plug and play car, get a mopar kit. If you want more and are going to tune it, stick with the stocker. If you already have a staged kit, you can sell it, or use it..your choice. The stage 2 is more of a prick with the piggybacks. Yes you can get them to work, but the pcm does act up with some of the piggies out there.
Is the return line needed?
If you are using a stage 2 car or bigger injectors with a piggyback, No it isnt. Its the easiest and cheapest way so thats why I recommend it.
Is a bigger fuel pump needed?
No a walbro 255 is not needed. The stock pump is good enough, but the 255 is only 100 beans. So its a good cheap mod that can be done while adding a return line.
Should I use a cooler thermostat?
YES! You will need to keep the car cool, otherwise your 300whp will drop pretty fast when racing. I recommend a fan switch! A fan switch is your friend. Look in the how 2 section for that. I use a 160 stat, and like it. Others like the 180. Each one will work fine.
Can i use a boostcontroller?
Yes. They arent needed with the AGP wga, thats why I dont mention them. They also spike the turbo more. They will work though
Are colder spark plugs needed?
NO. The stock plugs gapped as listed, work fine. Agp sells a nice set if you want to go aftermarket
Is a bigger FMIC needed?
I havent tuned a 300whp without one, but I would say no. Add some W/I in the mix, and that should get it done. It may take a bit more tuning also. You can also expect a faster decline in power when racing numerous times
What about Water injection?
This is a great mod. It will help with detonation, keeping the egts lower and aid with fueling. Timing will go up, and the combustion chamber gets cleaned. Might be used inplace of a big FMIC. I havent experienced 300whp without a cooler though
Tuning Questions:
Are the boost numbers listed needed and are they spiked or holding
A normal 300whp tune, I use 20 psi holding for awhile falling to 16. That should get it done. For more wtrq I spike it to 22 and falling to 16. You can get these numbers with lower boost, but it will take more tuning for sure. Try some things on the dyno and track and see what works best for you.
Can 20psi be held to redline
Yes, but I havent seen that much of a difference on the dyno to go through the hassel.
Can this be done on pump gas?
Check the mod lits, you see 94 octane on there right? Can it be done with lower octane? Maybe. Anything less than 93, I would use water/alchy injection to be on the safe side. I always recommend atleast 93 to my customers. Cali guys....well you get nice weather so stop beatchin
What fuel pressure should I use?
That needs to be proven on a wideband. No way to say for sure, with the different mods out there. I would start with 50psi with the vacuum line off. Then raise or lower from there
What about EGTs?
Oh boy not this again. If u follow the how 2, you wont have a problem. Street, dyno and track tested. Raising the timing along with a nice a/f ratio will keep the egts in check
What about a/f ratio?
Depends on the gas and persons choice. In an ideal sitiuation with all the tuning crap available.. I would like to see 12.4 across the board and falling to 11.8 at around 5600 to redline. Now that doesnt mean 12s are bad... It just, Thats what ideal is to me.
How do the vacuum lines get set up?
I always use the green line. I like the added torque. I run the pink line to the TB vacuum port, block the blue line and everything else. I dont use the soleniods at all. Also no BLEED is needed.
Misc questions
Will these mods void my warranty?
If you need to aske this question, you need to sell the car and move to greenland
Is this setup good for daily driving?
YES!! Thats the whole point, a 300whp daily driver.
How much does this setup cost?
Depends on the brands and if you bought the stuff new or not. So i wont ball park it
What is the expected track times with this setup?
Depends on driver, track prep and temp, and weight of the car. We all know what das has done, so aim for the 11s
Biggest question of them all:
IS THIS SETUP REALLY SAFE??
We have numerous cars that have thousands of miles with similar setups. not one person to my knowledge has had a problem. now things happen, and that should be taken into condsideration when modding your vehicle. Take it to someone who knows the SRT, not just cars. People make that mistake alot, and it hurst the wallet. Mod your car at your own risk. Running 300whp and higher boost will put alot of strain on the stock turbo. The life will be shortened. how long is unknown. We have cars with 50k miles at 20+psi , but that doesnt mean yours will last that long. I am available for installs and tuning if your in the cleveland ohio area, or want to drive in. Pm me for details
Last edited by aaronneon : 08-15-2005 at 06:23 PM.
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