umm...? try running your car without a return line or bigger injectors on a high hp (modified) car, and see what happens...
i didnt say anything about injectors, pump or anything like that...i just said a return setup...
i thought that it was necessary when i boosted my honda, and i went through all the trouble of converting it to a return style fuel system so that it would support the power, now i have friends with the same car making more power with just injectors, pump and fuel management....
i know what will happend if you dont upgrade and compensate for fuel, i am not stupid nor a newb...
all i want to know is why are people converting to a return setup with aftermarket fpr and return lines..i am not against it, i just want to know why it is necessary...if you know then answer the question...
i didnt say anything about injectors, pump or anything like that...i just said a return setup...
i thought that it was necessary when i boosted my honda, and i went through all the trouble of converting it to a return style fuel system so that it would support the power, now i have friends with the same car making more power with just injectors, pump and fuel management....
i know what will happend if you dont upgrade and compensate for fuel, i am not stupid nor a newb...
all i want to know is why are people converting to a return setup with aftermarket fpr and return lines..i am not against it, i just want to know why it is necessary...if you know then answer the question...
It's not hard at all to run a return line setup on this car....? buy aaronneon's kit, and it shouldn't take more than an 1-2 hours or so I would think...
aaronneon.com < $360 for his return line setup....
or you can spend more money if you don't want a return line, and use a SAFC ($350), or mapclamp ($30) which is the cheapest / easiest way to go along with a wideband for our cars along with some bigger injectors, and use the mapclamp/safc whichever you choose + wideband to tune it for good a/f ratios...
It's not hard at all to run a return line setup on this car....? buy aaronneon's kit, and it shouldn't take more than an 1-2 hours or so I would think...
aaronneon.com < $360 for his return line setup....
or you can spend more money if you don't want a return line, and use a SAFC ($350), or mapclamp ($30) which is the cheapest / easiest way to go along with a wideband for our cars along with some bigger injectors, and use the mapclamp/safc whichever you choose + wideband to tune it for good a/f ratios...
come on guys...help me out here...i am looking for the technical reason why we need to run a return setup when we are making high horsepower...
i dont care how easy or hard it is to do, it doesnt matter to me..
All i want to know is why is it necessary for the srt to have it when making big power...
i am trying to prove some honda people wrong here, so help me out
so it wouldnt be necessary to have a return line and a safc??
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The technical reason(s) are these, listen closely, when you have a high horsepower car (300+) the last injectors on the rail get starved of fuel without a fuel return line back into the tank. The return allows the fuel to evenly go THROUGH the rail offering all the injectors the same amount of fuel. Also, a return system uses a 1to1 fuel pressure regulator, per every psi of boost you'll get a psi of fuel pressure! Hope this clears things up
so it wouldnt be necessary to have a return line and a safc??
safc I'm assuming might have better abilities to keep your A/F a lil steadier than a mapclamp?? I'm not sure, but with a $30 price tag on a mapclamp, you can't go wrong...and it will work just fine.
I'm staying with a mapclamp, and my next modification will be a aaronneon kit....whenever I get the funds.
The technical reason is this, listen closely, when you have a high horsepower car (300+) the last injectors on the rail get starved of fuel without a fuel return line back into the tank. The return allows the fuel to evenly go THROUGH the rail offering all the injectors the same amount of fuel. Hope this cleared everything up.
If I'm wrong, someone with HANDS ON experience jump in here... I'm only an engineer (3 more classes). You DON'T NEED a fuel return kit. The last injector getting "starved" is a result of insufficient fuel pressure and/or fuel rail volume. The reason newer cars have this system is to meet Federal requirements for evaporative emissions. A returnless system will work fine with high horsepower (hence, stg. 3); IF someone can TUNE it and properly match the components (AND avoid unwanted pressure differentials w/i the rail). Many tuners just swap back to the old return system because its easier to set a static fuel pressure with injector PWM (Pulse Width Modulation, to control flow) than to set up a seperate fuel pressure table (pump voltage) for all possibilities of throttle angle, mani. pressure, injector duty cycle, etc. A pro, with the right background, resources and TIME could make a returnless system work with a really high hp car. Of course, at the moment, that would entail ripping out the factory ecu and wiring and swapping in a MoTec or other high end programmable system with lots of functions. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.
Last edited by gvilleSRT : 12-14-2005 at 10:09 AM.
Well the real reason for a return system is you could use a 1to1 fuel pressure regulator, per every psi of boost you'll get a psi of fuel pressure.
example big turbo SRT4:
at lets say 21psi of boost no return system with big injectors and fuel pump.
all you are doing is adding an huge amount of fuel since a 750 cc injectors is normally rated at 43psi not 58psi. if the car doesnt have a piggy back it will be pig rich. with a piggy back you'll have to take alot of fuel out which it will add timing which it means you'll make more power but it will NOT last long.. Detonation.
with a return system you'll be able to better tune the car for driveability as well as WOT, and not worry about taking out so much fuel out, since it will be there only when u need it WOT under boost.
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Why Return Fuel Setup on High Horsepower
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