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post #1 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-08-2017, 07:41 PM Thread Starter
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Post need to overhaul brakes/suspension need input

So let me first say that there is a lot of information to cover and I do appreciate using the search function, and have used said function to compile as much mental information as I can retain at this point. This community is super awesome with the plethora of information on hand (Thanks guys). I think I've got most if not all points covered but would still like some input and help with filling in any possible things I need to add or changes I need to make. My car is a 2005 ACR with approximately 99K miles on it, so most if not all rubber bits have gone kaput with these NY winters. My car is a daily driver with 80K of those miles put on it by me and has seen every winter since 2007. She's held up well with little to no problems and has even saved my life on several occasions, i.e. several feet of snow and subzero temperatures; avoided countless accidents, etc., you get the idea. It's time to pay her some serious love and that's where you guys chime in. So now onto the list and soon to be my empty wallet. ;-)

[This is stuff either on or going on car soon]

Suspension:

Energy Suspension Bushing Kit; (front not on yet, rear I have done)

Solid engine/transmission mounts including 4th mount; (not installed yet)

ACR F/R sway bars; (nice and rusty)

DC Sports F/R strut bars; (not installed yet)

ACR Tokico struts; (past their prime)



Brakes:

Calipers OE; (fronts no good, have been sticking need a rebuild)

Power Slot F/R slotted rotors; (front they're shot look at pics, rear are okay)

Pads; (Hawk HPS; pass front melted off, drive front pretty much gone to)

Brake Fluid; (Motul RBF 600)

Brake lines; (squishy original)



[This is possible/future buy; stuff to go on the car; input appreciated]

Suspension:

Hotchkis F/R sway bars #22419

KW Variant 2; (F:340 lbs./in R:170 lbs./in; change them to F:350F lbs./in and R:300 lbs./in?)

Tie rod inner/outer; (MOOG #EV404, MOOG #ES3173RL; do I need a dust boot?)

Rear lower control arm; (MOOG #RK100001 or MOOG #K100001; Mopar #P4510870; SPC Performance #67210, do these have poly bushings?; Bwoody #120.202)

Front lower control arm; (right MOOG #CK620010, left MOOG #CK620009; Mopar *MP #220309-KIT)

*MP – Modern Performance



Brakes:

Calipers; (Power Stop remanufactured w/ powder coating F/R)

Rotors; (OEM F/R #5273141AB, #5085652AB) or

(CENTRIC C-TEK F/R #12163053, #12163054) or

(CENTRIC Premium/Cryo-Treated F/R #12063053/CRY, #12063054/CRY) or

(CENTRIC HighCarb/Cryo-Treated F/R #12563053/CRY, #12563054/CRY)

Pads; (OEM F/R #5086364AB, #5086567AB) or

(CENTRIC C-TEK Metallic F/R #10208410, #10205120) or

(CENTRIC C-TEK Ceramic F/R #10308410, #10305120) or

(CENTRIC Premium Semi-Met F/R #30008410, 30005120) or

(CENTRIC Posi-Quiet Extended F/R #10608411, #10605120) or

*I'm thinking these might be a little excessive for daily driving*

(POWER STOP Z23 Evolution Sport F/R #Z23841, # Z23512) or

*I keep reading good things about these*

(Carbotech Bobcat 1521 F/R #CT841-1521, #CT658-1521)

Brake fluid; (ATE #706202{replaced #706302 I think}, any other alternative to Motul?)

Stainless Brake lines; (Russell Street Legal #694310; Goodridge G-Stop #12408; Agency Power #405 and 410)



Drivetrain:

Wheel hub & bearing; (Front: Mopar OEM hub, Timken Set49 bearing; Rear: Timken #512167)

Axle nut kit; (Mopar *MP #221181-AXLENUTKI, Is it the same for all four? Can't find the part #)

Wheel bearing dust cap; (rear only I'm guessing; possible part #4509396; need input)

Extended wheel studs; (ARP #100-7721 all four corners)

*MP – Modern Performance



I'll upload some pics of my old lady when I can.




"I know what I'm talking about I've got a power point presentation" -J.J. (Stanley Steemer)

Last edited by finchmeister; 06-08-2017 at 07:45 PM.
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post #2 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-13-2017, 07:49 PM Thread Starter
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Driver side front. You can see all of the corrosion and rust, along with the snapped stud and broken ground.
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post #3 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-13-2017, 07:57 PM Thread Starter
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Driver side rear with all energy suspension poly bushings.
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post #4 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-13-2017, 08:04 PM Thread Starter
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Passenger side front in all of its rusty glory.
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post #5 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-13-2017, 08:11 PM Thread Starter
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Passenger rear and the only thing that isn't messed up really is the caliper.
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post #6 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 02:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finchmeister View Post
So let me first say that there is a lot of information to cover and I do appreciate using the search function, and have used said function to compile as much mental information as I can retain at this point. This community is super awesome with the plethora of information on hand (Thanks guys). I think I've got most if not all points covered but would still like some input and help with filling in any possible things I need to add or changes I need to make. My car is a 2005 ACR with approximately 99K miles on it, so most if not all rubber bits have gone kaput with these NY winters. My car is a daily driver with 80K of those miles put on it by me and has seen every winter since 2007. She's held up well with little to no problems and has even saved my life on several occasions, i.e. several feet of snow and subzero temperatures; avoided countless accidents, etc., you get the idea. It's time to pay her some serious love and that's where you guys chime in. So now onto the list and soon to be my empty wallet. ;-)

[This is stuff either on or going on car soon]

Suspension:

Energy Suspension Bushing Kit; (front not on yet, rear I have done)

Solid engine/transmission mounts including 4th mount; (not installed yet)

ACR F/R sway bars; (nice and rusty)

DC Sports F/R strut bars; (not installed yet)

ACR Tokico struts; (past their prime)



Brakes:

Calipers OE; (fronts no good, have been sticking need a rebuild)

Power Slot F/R slotted rotors; (front they're shot look at pics, rear are okay)

Pads; (Hawk HPS; pass front melted off, drive front pretty much gone to)

Brake Fluid; (Motul RBF 600)

Brake lines; (squishy original)



[This is possible/future buy; stuff to go on the car; input appreciated]

Suspension:

Hotchkis F/R sway bars #22419 These are great.

KW Variant 2; (F:340 lbs./in R:170 lbs./in; change them to F:350F lbs./in and R:300 lbs./in?) No need to do the minor change on front rates, but the rear change will balance out the handling of the car.

Tie rod inner/outer; (MOOG #EV404, MOOG #ES3173RL; do I need a dust boot?) No boots needed.

Rear lower control arm; (MOOG #RK100001 or MOOG #K100001; Mopar #P4510870; SPC Performance #67210, do these have poly bushings?; Bwoody #120.202) SPC/Mopar (same thing) are fine as-is. Never been complaints about them. The Moog are interesting adn I haven't seen one in person.

Front lower control arm; (right MOOG #CK620010, left MOOG #CK620009; Mopar *MP #220309-KIT) Don't see the point in new arms if you're already using or wanting to use ES poly bushings. Only benefit would be not needing to press in a new ball joint.

*MP – Modern Performance



Brakes:

Calipers; (Power Stop remanufactured w/ powder coating F/R) Should be good, but I've been using parts store rebuilds and duplicolor paint if I care about keeping them red. My latest set I didn't care to paint.

Rotors; (OEM F/R #5273141AB, #5085652AB) or

(CENTRIC C-TEK F/R #12163053, #12163054) or

(CENTRIC Premium/Cryo-Treated F/R #12063053/CRY, #12063054/CRY) or

(CENTRIC HighCarb/Cryo-Treated F/R #12563053/CRY, #12563054/CRY) For a daily driver I don't see the benefit of expensive rotors. I also don't like slotted or drilled as it just increases pad wear and dust. On a drag race car you want the lighter weight, but on a road race car I'd go with an s-cut or c-cut at most.

Pads; (OEM F/R #5086364AB, #5086567AB) or Great everyday pads but expensive.

(CENTRIC C-TEK Metallic F/R #10208410, #10205120) or

(CENTRIC C-TEK Ceramic F/R #10308410, #10305120) or

(CENTRIC Premium Semi-Met F/R #30008410, 30005120) or

(CENTRIC Posi-Quiet Extended F/R #10608411, #10605120) or

*I'm thinking these might be a little excessive for daily driving*

(POWER STOP Z23 Evolution Sport F/R #Z23841, # Z23512) or Have had good luck with Power Stop pads on other vehicles

*I keep reading good things about these*

(Carbotech Bobcat 1521 F/R #CT841-1521, #CT658-1521) LOVE these. I don't have working ABS on my car and these allow me to modulate the brakes just the way I need to. Great feel, incredible brake life (last two techs to look over my car have thought the pads were brand new, but they have about 40k miles and multiple stuck calipers on them). Carbotech brakes are very easy on the rotors and the dust doesn't eat at the finish on the wheels. Worth the extra money to me for the front, still running stock rears.

Brake fluid; (ATE #706202{replaced #706302 I think}, any other alternative to Motul?) I run parts store stuff, nothing fancy.
Just flush it every 2 years.


Stainless Brake lines; (Russell Street Legal #694310; Goodridge G-Stop #12408; Agency Power #405 and 410) Stainless is needed. I think I have the Russell lines on my car. One thing to note is to clock the rears away from the tire. I had rubbing on the left rear and had to fix it after a test drive.



Drivetrain:

Wheel hub & bearing; (Front: Mopar OEM hub, Timken Set49 bearing; Rear: Timken #512167) Good choices.

Axle nut kit; (Mopar *MP #221181-AXLENUTKI, Is it the same for all four? Can't find the part #) I've always reused the axle nut hardware, but it's cheap and if yours is rusty, not a bad idea.

Wheel bearing dust cap; (rear only I'm guessing; possible part #4509396; need input) Meh, if you want to.

Extended wheel studs; (ARP #100-7721 all four corners) Only if you need them because of wheel spacers. I wouldn't bother even going to stronger stock length studs unless you are hitting the road course regularly.

*MP – Modern Performance



I'll upload some pics of my old lady when I can.
notes in red
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post #7 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 02:28 PM
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And looking at the pictures, definitely replace the axle nut hardware. I'd think about taking a wire wheel to a lot of those parts, sanding them down, priming, and painting while it's all apart. That's a lot of rust. Hit up Modern or a dealer for all of the bolts and adjusters for the control arms. Get new clevis bolts as well, but no need for crash/camber versions, stock will be fine.
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post #8 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 07:30 PM
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Originally Posted by stowaway View Post
And looking at the pictures, definitely replace the axle nut hardware. I'd think about taking a wire wheel to a lot of those parts, sanding them down, priming, and painting while it's all apart. That's a lot of rust. Hit up Modern or a dealer for all of the bolts and adjusters for the control arms. Get new clevis bolts as well, but no need for crash/camber versions, stock will be fine.
I assisted a buddy of mine in doing front wheel bearings, ball joints, bushings etc - he had been running just a nut and washer. I told him he really REALLY needs to go get a new spindle nut/kit with all the fixings - like what, 10$ at the parts store? he said no it was fine been running forever like this etc...ok then. He came back from a ~800 mile journey, one nut backed off - tire trashed, wheel damaged, bearing shot, caliper damaged lol. Never not run these parts!

For the rear inner control arm bolts - do we even have a source for these?

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post #9 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 08:05 PM
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Dealer can get them, or the specs and get a bolt from fastenal. Inner are M12x1.75x242 and outer are M12x1.75x230.50.
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post #10 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 08:06 PM
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Pn 06502796 and 06503203 respectively.
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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-15-2017, 05:22 AM
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i did the front break lines too.
also, i had poly front bushings and wouldn't do them again, get moog problem solver LCA's -- better product

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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-16-2017, 10:56 AM Thread Starter
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i did the front break lines too.
also, i had poly front bushings and wouldn't do them again, get moog problem solver LCA's -- better product
I was almost certain that, (right MOOG #CK620010 , left MOOG #CK620009 ), both contained (MOOG #K200797 ). As part of the full package. All in all it's way cheaper than the alternative. Plus putting those two parts in would just be easier for me than sourcing the tools necessary to press out the old bushings and save time on labor cost when I bring the car to the shop.




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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-16-2017, 09:29 PM Thread Starter
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I want to replace my old wheel studs with ARP extended wheel studs because I don't know what the future holds for the car so I want to future proof it until I'm ready to get some new rims. Hopefully by the end of the year I can replace my BBS rims with something a little more economical for tires. Also I've been reading that I need to open up the front hub a tad and the rears quite a bit.
So our front hubs are at 9/16 and our rears are at 17/32:

Quote:
Having just replaced my front hub and reusing the ARP studs, I can tell you that they don't just " go in there". According to ARP, you have a press tolerance on the knurls. Well after doing some research of my own, ARP suggests an ~.005 press tolerance for steel parts and ~.007 tolerance for aluminum parts. 9/16's is .5625 and the wheel stud specs for the knurled portion is .590. Thats ~.028 clearance and that is not enough. So I had to create a CNC program on the mill to cut a circle pocket in the hub to ~.580. That left anywhere between .005 and .010 tolerance and most of the studs measured out to be .585 due to being previously pressed in to the old hubs. So they do not just "go right in". Don't be fooled or you will wind up ruining your hub/studs. Do it right.




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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-17-2017, 11:25 AM
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Originally Posted by stowaway View Post
Dealer can get them, or the specs and get a bolt from fastenal. Inner are M12x1.75x242 and outer are M12x1.75x230.50.
I picked these up 5 years ago for the rear outer knuckles to replace one bolt I had to cut short when extracting but never got around to using them. Would the 2mm make a difference if used on the inners? I managed to save all 4 bolts...they mostly had to have their nuts cut off so there isn't much threads holding the current nuts on but it's gone for 4-5 years with no issue torqued to spec. Should probably just get those 230.5mm bolts and do the whole rear end again....


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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-17-2017, 12:40 PM
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so long as you get the nut fully threaded, a few mm long or short won't hurt.
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