9mm vs 45acp

[Toyota-Mopar]

I would like to get a handgun and I'm torn between the two.

What do you guys recommend that doesn't cost too much but also holds a good amount of rounds.

I know revolvers are more reliable but I like automatics much better.

Btw, what's the difference between single and double action?


The 9mm is probably cheaper but doesn't have the stopping power of a 45.
I wanna be able to stop a fat hairy liberal from breaking into my home and stealing my stuff and sodomizing my dogs.

[1SLOWSRT]

That's like asking Chevy versus Ford. Any of the gun forums like the Firing Line, The High Road, or Glock Talk have E-fights break out daily over this subject.

The simple fact is that a bigger hole is better which would mean the .45, but I carry a 9mm daily and have far more 9mm than .45's Each have multiple advantages and disadvantages that you'll have to decide for yourself which is more important.

My reasons for choosing the 9 are as follows: much higher round count (for example my daily carry Glock 19 which is considered a compact holds 15+1 while my full size 1911 which is much larger and heavier carrys 7+1 standard). The 9mm also has the ability to fit into a smaller package such as a Keltec PF9 if you choose to carry and want something comfortable to wear you aren't going to find a .45 that weighs 12oz. There is typically going to be less felt recoil with a 9mm, although a typical .45 isn't bad at all and felt recoil can be reversed if shooting a small framed 9mm versus a full size 1911. Price is also a motivator for me. I go to the range a lot and get range ammo from Walmart, a box of 50 rounds of blazer brass in 9mm costs $8.97 versus $14.97 for a box of .45 That adds up quick when you shoot as much as I do. Finally a 9mm isn't going to kill anyone "less" dead. Most handgun rounds are poor performers in general, the one shot stop where people go flying into the air when hit is a myth. But if you do your job and place your shot where it needs to be if you ever God forbid have to to, it will do it's job just as well as a .45 can. With the advancements of modern hollow points you can still get great expansion and penetration from a 9mm when using a round such as Federal's 147g HST. This round is more than adequate and easily passes the FBI's ballistic tests for penetration and expansion as do the majority of modern hollow points.

As for what you want to buy, there are too many personal factors to consider given the information so far. How much is too much pricewise? How big are your hands? Is home defense all you want the gun for, do you want to carry it? How many rounds do you consider adequate? Do you want any external safeties? Does it have to be metal or can it be a polymer like a Glock or Springfield XD?

My best advice is to go to a local range that rents handguns and fire as many as you can. It isn't too expensive and you can get a better feel and opinion than by listening to random self proclaimed internet gun experts (like myself ) If you can't find a range close to you that rents them at least find a gun store that you can at least handle them.

As for the difference in single action versus double action, it simply refers to the amount of work that the trigger does when pulled. For example a pistol that fires in double action the hammer or striker will go back and forth on a single pull. Think of it like a pool stick hitting a cue ball, double action would be to pull the cue stick back and then push it forward to hit the cue ball with a single trigger pull. Single action is where the hammer or striker has already been cocked and pulling the trigger only releases the hammer forward.

Some pistols are available to fire both ways meaning that you can fire either with the hammer cocked or not, but the trigger pull is going to feel very different between the two. Generally a double action pull is much heavier because it is cocking and firing the round while single action is much lighter because it is only releasing the hammer.

[lifeisdeath]

Quote: Originally Posted by Toyota-Mopar

I would like to get a handgun and I'm torn between the two.

What do you guys recommend that doesn't cost too much but also holds a good amount of rounds.

I know revolvers are more reliable but I like semi-automatics much better.

Btw, what's the difference between single and double action?


The 9mm is probably cheaper but doesn't have the stopping power of a 45.
I wanna be able to stop a fat hairy liberal from breaking into my home and stealing my stuff and sodomizing my dogs.

ideally, you want something that puts the biggest hole in them possible. you also have to worry about over penetration, do you live in a house or an apartment? 9mm is usually cheaper, but not by much. it also will hold more rounds and has less recoil, so is more accurate for newer shooters.


as for SA vs DA:


Single-action auto means you pull the hammer back before pulling the trigger or the action cocks the hammer before pulling the trigger.

Double-action means you can lower the hammer to half-cock (or, if you're really brave, lower it all the way) then pull the trigger and it will cock the hammer during the trigger pull before dropping it on the firing pin. Then there are striker-fired, which are generally double-action only, being cocked by the pull of the trigger, rather than the action cycling. (There may be some single-action striker-fired autos, but none come immediately to mind.)

DA/SA can fire both ways.

DAO can only fire double-action (trigger pull cocks the hammer)

SA can only fire single-action (cock the hammer, then pull the trigger)

"Having trained, and trained with a variety of law enforcement, I see many who prefer single action autos (specifically the 1911 pattern gun) over double action autos.

Amongst those "in the know," it is primarily because of the fact that on a single action auto, the first shot is just like the rest, and that can occasionally be critical. Something else to understand from an historical perspective, the 1911 and Browning HP (originally S/A), as designed by Browning, were for military use. This is a fine point: when a military handgun is drawn in combat, it IS going to be used! It's a last ditch weapon...and a military one at that. Traditionally military smallarms have all been single action in nature, that is the trigger performs a single action: dropping the hammer or striker. Note the pump action shotgun, M1 Garand, Mauser Kar-98, M1 Carbine, M-14, M16...all have single action triggers. Browning knew the advantages of a single action weapon.

For civilian use (defensively speaking), what I teach is this: the PERFECT DEFENSIVE use of a handgun, is when the handgun STOPS the attack WITHOUT having to be fired. Here is where, perhaps, a double action handgun has a small advantage: it is far more forgiving for any sloppy trigger-finger work than a single action auto. When a military combatant pulls his handgun, it's to shoot it. When a civilian pulls a handgun, he or she may not be shooting it. Grandma in the wheelchair or uncle Charley grabbing his gun from the drawer really do not want to have to shoot someone, but, ready or not, they have the gun to do it should push come to shove.

Does this mean I advocate less than perfect training and practice? NO! But, it does mean I recognize that the world is not perfect, and people goof.

Now, the choice. First, a single action handgun such as the Browning HP or a 1911 pattern gun require more training to be safe, and are far less forgiving for any mistake made. Double action handguns are inherently safer (read "foolish friendly"), but that first double action shot is tough to make fast AND accurate, and then there is the slight grip/trigger change to accomodate the rest of the shots which will be single action in nature.

Neither really has any distinct advantage (defensively speaking) over the other, if and only if, you as a shooter take the time to become proficient with the weapon you choose. Or, more accurately, any advantage the single action handgun has is usually outweighed by the myraid of other concerns and circumstances that will arise from such an occasion.

In competition, single action autos rule the day when speed is wieghted just ahead of accuracy, as in IPSC shooting. But, this is primarily because these competitors are being measured in tenths of a second, and that first double action shot could make or break you, from either a time or accuracy point of view. With a double action auto, you get either speed, or accuracy, but not both to the same degree that a single action auto will net for you.

On a last note, when training people or shooting in my club, I see many double action shooters thumb the hammer back before they start shooting the stage or practicing on the target.

I stop them, have them safely lower the hammer, and shoot their first shot from D/A. I say "You chose the gun, learn to shoot it right, or buy a 1911!"

[paint]

.45ACP >>>>>>>> 9mm

[lifeisdeath]

agreed

[paint]

I sort of like M9s, but unless I just have millions to blow, I will probably never buy one because its 9mm.

[Toyota-Mopar]

thanks for the replies. i might go with the 45acp.

how about the ones without hammer like the glocks?

which is the most reliable?

I think I might also go with the single action. my philosophy with guns is that I won't point it at anyone unless there's a 100% chance I want to shoot them.

[paint]

Glocks are great reliable guns. Im just not a Glock fan however. But a .40 or .45 Glock would be a good investment.

[master_1011]

I have a M9...good gun. Kinda on the heavy side, but feels solid.


Oh, and FYI, California has a limit on 10 rounds per magazine for ANY handgun. Even though the M9 can hold a 15 round mag, I can only buy 10 round mags in Cali....

[JmalB]

This reminds me that I need to get to the range more...

[Toyota-Mopar]

I think I want an M1911.

What's a good maker? Decent price and made in USA if possible.

[ptperformance]

Is this a carry weapon? If so, get a 9mm subcompact, do not get a full frame unless you are a big guy.

Not a carry weapon, get the 40 or 45. My favorite round is the 10mm and I know you didn't ask but let me explain.

A 9mm is a great round but will not be effective through a car door or more then 1 wall in your house. A 45 will be great for wall's in your house but cars doors not so well. The 40 is a good all around gun but lacks the punch of a 45. Here comes the 10mm, great for all listed above. The only problem with the 10mm is you have to watch your back drop for passing rounds. When you shoot a 10mm it has the problmes of being to powerfull and will pass through several walls and make it through both doors in a car.

DA vs SA. Use the DA pistol if your in LE this keeps you from shooting your perp to quickly. Use the SA set ups for personal use trigger pull is the same everytime and you don't have to train yourself for the 2 to the body and one to the head with the changing trigger puls.

If it were me and it was a carry weapon, 9mm hi cap subcompact quality gun (sig or HK). Non carry weapon for home deffence, 10mm Glock or SW if you can find one. Hope this helps.

[ptperformance]

Quote: Originally Posted by Toyota-Mopar

I think I want an M1911.

What's a good maker? Decent price and made in USA if possible.

SW or Kimber, do not skimp on price when it comes to a good gun. I would also take a look at the HK for a gun in that chamber.

[wannasupra]

i like the G22. it's a 40 cal. it's sort of in between the .45 acp and 9 mm. you get the ballistics of a 9 mm, better range and velocity being the main benefits, and nearly the stopping power of a .45. plus, iirc the rounds aren't that super expensive. as far as guns, i've always liked beretta, shotguns and handguns, but the glock just feels right, especially with a topped off high cap mag. if you have smaller hands, you may consider an extended slide release and extended mag release for the glock.

[Alpha-Omega]

Quote: Originally Posted by ptperformance

Is this a carry weapon? If so, get a 9mm subcompact, do not get a full frame unless you are a big guy.

Not a carry weapon, get the 40 or 45. My favorite round is the 10mm and I know you didn't ask but let me explain.

A 9mm is a great round but will not be effective through a car door or more then 1 wall in your house. A 45 will be great for wall's in your house but cars doors not so well. The 40 is a good all around gun but lacks the punch of a 45. Here comes the 10mm, great for all listed above. The only problem with the 10mm is you have to watch your back drop for passing rounds. When you shoot a 10mm it has the problmes of being to powerfull and will pass through several walls and make it through both doors in a car.

DA vs SA. Use the DA pistol if your in LE this keeps you from shooting your perp to quickly. Use the SA set ups for personal use trigger pull is the same everytime and you don't have to train yourself for the 2 to the body and one to the head with the changing trigger puls.

If it were me and it was a carry weapon, 9mm hi cap subcompact quality gun (sig or HK). Non carry weapon for home deffence, 10mm Glock or SW if you can find one. Hope this helps.

I don't understand why the .45 can't be a carry weapon.

My sub-compact Glock [.45] is smaller than my wife's S&W 9mm and holds more rounds. It's wider, but overall it's smaller.